This week’s theme: when doing good breaks the law. Christian and Amy take a look at civil disobedience and discuss their personal struggles with protest and civil disobedience, Jim Wallis’s recent arrest for civil disobedience in the Senate Office Building, the 6 steps to prepare your community for civil disobedience, the most (and least) effective tactics, and Christian, in what may the hardest interview he’s ever done, talks with CIA whistle-blower John Kiriakou.

As followers Jesus, people who believe we are called to do what’s right in the world, is breaking the law ever OK? What does it really mean to resist?

Plus, Billy Bush one year later, and the challenge of remembering someone’s good works only and not their faults. Would JFK, Ghandi, MLK have be indicted under the #MeToo movement? Should someone’s moral and ethical failings change how we view their legacy?

In the interview with John Kiriakou (columnist with Reader Supported News, former CIA analyst and senior investigator for the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, Counter-Terrorism consultant with ABC news, author of Doing Time Like a Spy, and perhaps most significantly a whistle-blower concerning torture techniques) Christian and John talk about getting recruited into the CIA, what a CIA analyst does, his switch from intelligence to counter-terrorism, what compelled him to share about the CIA’s use of waterboarding, and the fallout from that decision. They also touch on fake news and state-owned media organizations, and the difference between news and propaganda, whistle-blowing and leaking. Plus, John suggests that the Justice Department and Judiciary are in cahoots to fix trials involving the Justice Department. You won’t want to miss this one!

You can listen to the full, unedited interview with John Kiriakou by supporting the podcast at Not only will you be able to hear the full interview, you’ll be helping us reach our December goal of 10 new patrons!

Help us makes our December goal and get a chance to be on the show! Our goal is to get ten new patrons in December. Anyone who signs up in December (or increases their donation) will get to be a part of a new segment called Ask the Caster and the Pastor. This is where you’ll get to send in a 30 second audio clip asking a question about anything and Christian and Amy will answer it on air. Plus, each new patron will get a copy of Christian’s new book, Surviving the BibleVisit to begin your support today.

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